Post by Stallit 2 de Halfo on Sept 15, 2007 23:53:06 GMT
Antisocial youth are not scum, but symptoms.
Just reading over the discussion of a while back about the "Dublin Riots" and its causes on indymedia - its a very worthwhile read!
I thought id post this bit written by "Chekov" which I felt was very influential, and explains why we should view antisocial behaviour and those who take part in it in terms of the overall system, not the individual and their actions, which are a result of it.
By Chekov ('Feeney' I think).
"""All of those people who are going on about scum should be bloody ashamed of themselves. No human being is scum and there are reasons why people behave in certain ways.
75% of inmates in mountjoy come from 6 identifiable areas, pockets of deprivation in the city (John Lonergan, Mountjoy Governor). Ireland has the most unequal distribution of income in the EU (UN report 2002). Crime and anti-social behaviour are strongly correlated with poverty and inequality - to put it simply, if you have a society like ours where enormous wealth sits side by side with deprivation, you will have anti-social behaviour and it's nothing to do with people being 'scum' - it's social reality not choice. "lifestyle choices are limited by economic circumstances" (Health inequalities and Irish General Practice in areas of deprivation). 22% of the population live on weekly incomes of less than 164 euro per adult and 54 euro per child per week (combat poverty agency, 2004).
Young men living in over-crowded, deprived council estates suffer some of the worst consequences of this inequality. They see wealth and consumer goods all around them, they are sold a message that there are opportunities for all and that they have all the choices in the world, but the reality is that they are excluded from this wealth and have seriously limited choices. This produces destructive behaviour - they come to blame themselves for their inability to attain the wealth that is around them - hence hospitalisation rates for mental illness are more than six times higher for people in lower socio economic groups than for those in the higher groups and suicide rates are more than 5 times higher (public health alliance of Ireland 2003). Mortality rate in the lowest occupational class is 100%-200% higher than the rate in the highest occupational class (Balanda, Wilde 2001). This self destructive behaviour also manifests itself in terms of alcohol and drug abuse (heroin addiction is almost exclusively a problem for deprived young people). It also manifests itself in anti-social behaviour and crime.
Calling for harsher measures against such people is not only morally reprehensible, it is counter productive. A national representative study published in the BMJ showed 40% of irish prisoners inject drugs - 21% inject for the first time while in prison. That means that prison actually creates more problems than it solves in the long run. Troubled kids go into prison and many of them emerge with heroin habits which require a criminal lifestyle to feed. In any case, this group are already massively over-represented in prisons, 50% of prisoners are under 24 and 80% are under 35 (health in prisons project).
Those people who think that calling the most disadvantaged and unfortunate members of our society 'scum' is a solution to anything deserve a thrashing. In fact, they deserve to be brought up in a broken home, with an abusive, alcholic father and a mother who is addicted to heroin and regularly beaten and bullied. They then deserve to have a whole bunch of more fortunate people looking down upon them as 'scum'. In particular anybody who thinks that they are a socialist or progressive in any way and uses such terminology is a fucking hypocrite and a disgrace. """
www.indymedia.ie/article/74528
Just reading over the discussion of a while back about the "Dublin Riots" and its causes on indymedia - its a very worthwhile read!
I thought id post this bit written by "Chekov" which I felt was very influential, and explains why we should view antisocial behaviour and those who take part in it in terms of the overall system, not the individual and their actions, which are a result of it.
By Chekov ('Feeney' I think).
"""All of those people who are going on about scum should be bloody ashamed of themselves. No human being is scum and there are reasons why people behave in certain ways.
75% of inmates in mountjoy come from 6 identifiable areas, pockets of deprivation in the city (John Lonergan, Mountjoy Governor). Ireland has the most unequal distribution of income in the EU (UN report 2002). Crime and anti-social behaviour are strongly correlated with poverty and inequality - to put it simply, if you have a society like ours where enormous wealth sits side by side with deprivation, you will have anti-social behaviour and it's nothing to do with people being 'scum' - it's social reality not choice. "lifestyle choices are limited by economic circumstances" (Health inequalities and Irish General Practice in areas of deprivation). 22% of the population live on weekly incomes of less than 164 euro per adult and 54 euro per child per week (combat poverty agency, 2004).
Young men living in over-crowded, deprived council estates suffer some of the worst consequences of this inequality. They see wealth and consumer goods all around them, they are sold a message that there are opportunities for all and that they have all the choices in the world, but the reality is that they are excluded from this wealth and have seriously limited choices. This produces destructive behaviour - they come to blame themselves for their inability to attain the wealth that is around them - hence hospitalisation rates for mental illness are more than six times higher for people in lower socio economic groups than for those in the higher groups and suicide rates are more than 5 times higher (public health alliance of Ireland 2003). Mortality rate in the lowest occupational class is 100%-200% higher than the rate in the highest occupational class (Balanda, Wilde 2001). This self destructive behaviour also manifests itself in terms of alcohol and drug abuse (heroin addiction is almost exclusively a problem for deprived young people). It also manifests itself in anti-social behaviour and crime.
Calling for harsher measures against such people is not only morally reprehensible, it is counter productive. A national representative study published in the BMJ showed 40% of irish prisoners inject drugs - 21% inject for the first time while in prison. That means that prison actually creates more problems than it solves in the long run. Troubled kids go into prison and many of them emerge with heroin habits which require a criminal lifestyle to feed. In any case, this group are already massively over-represented in prisons, 50% of prisoners are under 24 and 80% are under 35 (health in prisons project).
Those people who think that calling the most disadvantaged and unfortunate members of our society 'scum' is a solution to anything deserve a thrashing. In fact, they deserve to be brought up in a broken home, with an abusive, alcholic father and a mother who is addicted to heroin and regularly beaten and bullied. They then deserve to have a whole bunch of more fortunate people looking down upon them as 'scum'. In particular anybody who thinks that they are a socialist or progressive in any way and uses such terminology is a fucking hypocrite and a disgrace. """
www.indymedia.ie/article/74528
