Lisbon Poll

[Stallit 2 de Halfo]

Same here, got the posters at a meeting.

AFAICS, its probably not a good idea just giving posters out because when it comes to taking them down, well, they might not. And the party get fined.

That would probably be a good idea to get a wad of FF posters and put them up the day after theyr supposed to take them down, and bankrupt the buggers with fines ;D

The posters im putting up are the one shown on the left on this site - www.people-before-profit.org/

Nice design so it is.

[anticapitalist]

They are the ones we got aswell, yeah i like the wording on them and i would say it gets people thinking it must be the strongest caption of them all.
don't think i will be taking them down, a good drop of rain on the 12th of June with a few gusts will do the trick, it took us a few hours this evening not to mention the first lot that got destroyed with the weather, i only used cable ties then, and they could be just cut off, this time i stapled them, so it will be harder to get them back down.

[Stallit 2 de Halfo]

They are the ones we got aswell, yeah i like the wording on them and i would say it gets people thinking it must be the strongest caption of them all.
don't think i will be taking them down, a good drop of rain on the 12th of June with a few gusts will do the trick, it took us a few hours this evening not to mention the first lot that got destroyed with the weather, i only used cable ties then, and they could be just cut off, this time i stapled them, so it will be harder to get them back down.

Yeah staples seem to be the way. That or maybe paste them back to back.

[Stallit 2 de Halfo]

IRSP poster against Lisbon.

[anticapitalist]

It's good to see that the I.R.S.P, have now got posters,

nice design, i like the idea of the European map on them, is that the usual shape on the top right of it? can't really make it out as it's not very clear, the caption is good,re the workers, have any of these posters been put up yet?
wonder will the E.U put a few more stars on the flag to represent the new members, they want to make it all bigger but so far have not even altered the flag to make it fair to all.

[anticapitalist]

Sorry for the shape of Europe question on the poster C.16, i should have looked at the atlas first, it is Norway Sweden and Finland, i just did not realise that they are based up so high, and thought the shape was off.

[Stallit 2 de Halfo]

It's good to see that the I.R.S.P, have now got posters,

nice design, i like the idea of the European map on them, is that the usual shape on the top right of it? can't really make it out as it's not very clear, the caption is good,re the workers, have any of these posters been put up yet?
wonder will the E.U put a few more stars on the flag to represent the new members, they want to make it all bigger but so far have not even altered the flag to make it fair to all.

The reason is that Norway isnt in the EU I dont think, so its not marked in.

The EU flag wont be changing because the stars dont represent each member state. The EU flag was actually designed by an Irish man, and the stars represent a clock and the passing of time. Thats why there's 12 stars.

We put up a good few of them around town (in the rain ) and I also put a few up around my own area.

The thing is, is that the paper is like ordianry paper out of a printer, so I cant see them lasting with the rain.

I was also told that today was the last day in which people are 'allowed' legally to put up posters.

[Papa C.]

I think the no camp has failed to give adequete information to working people.

While the YES camp have 'for jobs, for the economy' vote yes. The NO camp have 'let's make europe better, keep our commissioner'. What do these things mean. The people have to know that Lisbon is bad. I may seem hypocritical for not putting up SPI posters (I haven't tried because I've no time or materiels - I know for a fact that Fine Gael got a private company to put their posters up for them and I presume Labour and FF did the same. Gone are the days when the party themselves and the youth wings would go out and put up posters), but I if we were to do it I think slogans like:

For higher wages - vote no, to stop hospital closures - vote no, Say no to EU rule - vote no, say no to war - vote no, don't make ireland a target for terrorism - vote no.

I think these are the sorts of slogans that working people will take notice of. Working people care not for Eu politics. They care about their families, having enough money to pay the bills, lowering bills, lowering outgoing and higher wages. They don't care if Bertie robs them blind as long as they have food on the table, money for the weekend, money for bills and perhaps a holiday. They are going to follow anyone who can give them prosperity (or what they would see as)

I don't mean to generalise but most of the electorate care for these things and that's why FF are in power again - because they claimed they could provide it. Most of those who have lost faith in the major political parties don't even bother to vote because they know they can't change anything. I think it is in our interest to build up the protest vote and use it to oust the major political parties.

[Stallit 2 de Halfo]

I think the no camp has failed to give adequete information to working people.

While the YES camp have 'for jobs, for the economy' vote yes. The NO camp have 'let's make europe better, keep our commissioner'. What do these things mean. The people have to know that Lisbon is bad. I may seem hypocritical for not putting up SPI posters (I haven't tried because I've no time or materiels - I know for a fact that Fine Gael got a private company to put their posters up for them and I presume Labour and FF did the same. Gone are the days when the party themselves and the youth wings would go out and put up posters), but I if we were to do it I think slogans like:

For higher wages - vote no, to stop hospital closures - vote no, Say no to EU rule - vote no, say no to war - vote no, don't make ireland a target for terrorism - vote no.

I think these are the sorts of slogans that working people will take notice of. Working people care not for Eu politics. They care about their families, having enough money to pay the bills, lowering bills, lowering outgoing and higher wages. They don't care if Bertie robs them blind as long as they have food on the table, money for the weekend, money for bills and perhaps a holiday. They are going to follow anyone who can give them prosperity (or what they would see as)

I don't mean to generalise but most of the electorate care for these things and that's why FF are in power again - because they claimed they could provide it. Most of those who have lost faith in the major political parties don't even bother to vote because they know they can't change anything. I think it is in our interest to build up the protest vote and use it to oust the major political parties.

I dont know now PapaC. I could certainly say that for groups like Libertas, or Coir (who have AFAICS the most No posters up) or even Sinn Fein this is the case.

I think both PBP/SWP and the SP have slogans similar to the ones you mention. The PBP has a slogan about 'War', which is something that people would be wary of. And the SP have privatization on their posters. the PM have some good relevent slogans too on their posters.

And also, and I dont mean to be biased, but i think the No camp have put their arguments during, for example TV and radio debates much better across.

The No camp have actually put forward people who can communicate their views more effectivly. Garreth Fitzgerald mumbles and can bearly be heard (he was up againt RBB on RTE), the guy charged with the lisbon treaty for FF is an evident con artist, a sneak and looks like one too, yer woman chochlane from FF got destroyed on radio by a guy from libertas. These people havnt even read the treaty!! appart from the sneak, so they dont have a clue and cant refute the No camp.

As i said, I know of a trad FF voter who was one over from hearing the debates.

On the No side we have Patricia McKenna, brilliant communicater and knows her stuff, Mary Lou, who is also a good communicater, RBB also good, Joe higgins who is good at rhetoric. Libertas who have some good people. Coir are crap at debating from what i have heard of them.

And I think the Yes side are equally if not more guilty of crap slogans like 'Vote Yes, its good for ireland" "Vote yes for the economy". They are so expected like, they would say that.

So I dont agree. I think the No side has communicated their views better from what i have seen, and especially considering the resources available to them.

The simple fact that the No camp is getting so much attention is an achievement in itself given that the entire establishment is against it appart from a mini Sinn Fein.

[Papa C.]

Points taken there comrade. I agree that the NO camp have some good communicators but the PBP posters aren't everywhere and the writing is quite small on them also. There's a couple of great posters up with great arguments but if you want to read them you'd have to get out of the car and go right up to them and lets face it, few are going to do that. I think considering the people in the no camp the/ we could have done more. The 1.3million libertas are spending could have gone on better things than two okay posters that some people can't understand.

[Stallit 2 de Halfo]

Points taken there comrade. I agree that the NO camp have some good communicators but the PBP posters aren't everywhere and the writing is quite small on them also. There's a couple of great posters up with great arguments but if you want to read them you'd have to get out of the car and go right up to them and lets face it, few are going to do that. I think considering the people in the no camp the/ we could have done more. The 1.3million libertas are spending could have gone on better things than two okay posters that some people can't understand.

I agree with you entirely. The left just dont have the resources (nor manpower) though. And libertas are hardly going to pump a few thousand into the socialist party No campaign ;D

[Papa C.]

True. I think the left really should have extended the hand of comradeship to each other well before the build up to the treaty so they could unite in an attempt to get a NO vote.