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Post by Papa C. on Jun 22, 2009 20:49:34 GMT
It seems that former PD (Progressive Democrats) member and president of the 'European Movement International', Pat Cox (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pat_Cox), has stepped down from his post so that he can lead the new 'Ireland for Europe' (www.irelandforeurope.org/) campaign. These right wingers are campaigning for a 'yes' vote obviously and have people like Robbie Keane and other well known figures involved in their campaign. It seems that this campaign will be an uphill battle for the 'No' camp and it could be worth our while getting started sooner rather than later. I think the 'No' camp should be focusing on facts like: 1. If we vote 'yes' we will lose our right to a free transparent referendum on future EU decisions and treaties as the EU can simply over-rule our vote. 2. We have already voted 'No' to this referendum yet they have shown utter contempt for our democratic rights by making us vote yet again. We had to vote twice on the Nice treaty because we rejected it and now we have to vote twice on Lisbon because we rejected it. When will the politicians respect our vote? 3. Politicians have used their powers over us to make us vote twice on 2 seperate referenda. We should use and protect our democratic rights by voting 'No' in this campaign and show politicians that we will not part with our democratic rights! Links: Ireland for Europe wiki - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ireland_for_EuropeEuropean Movement website = www.europeanmovement.euEuropean Movement wiki - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Movement |
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Post by untilvictory32 on Jun 22, 2009 21:03:42 GMT
While the Fenian Movement is more right than left we support a no vote 100%. Everything that can be done to stop this should be done. Ireland deservers to be independent and not part of this corrupt union.
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Post by Papa C. on Jun 23, 2009 20:51:16 GMT
Well, although both movements are supporting a 'no' vote in the Lisbon2 agreement, the Fenian movement must be at odds with the Irish Republican movement. Irish Republicans are leftists and have always been struggling for a Socialist Republic ever since Wolfe Tone.
"If the men of property will not support us, they must fall. Our strength shall come from that great and respectable class, the men of no property". - Theobold Wolfe Tone.
Today Irish Republicans continue to fight for a democratic country run by, what was once termed as, the 'men of no property'.
I think all countries deserve to be independent and free from corruption and polyarchies especially within socialist societies.
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Post by untilvictory32 on Jun 25, 2009 1:37:31 GMT
Well, although both movements are supporting a 'no' vote in the Lisbon2 agreement, the Fenian movement must be at odds with the Irish Republican movement. Irish Republicans are leftists and have always been struggling for a Socialist Republic ever since Wolfe Tone. "If the men of property will not support us, they must fall. Our strength shall come from that great and respectable class, the men of no property". - Theobold Wolfe Tone. Today Irish Republicans continue to fight for a democratic country run by, what was once termed as, the 'men of no property'. I think all countries deserve to be independent and free from corruption and polyarchies especially within socialist societies. In regards to the Fenian Movement being at odds with the Republican Movement yes on some levels. Politically we are not going to say Socialism is the best and only way as the world has proven that not to be the case and on the same hand we are not going to say Capitalism is the best as we know different. Unity is what we seek but it has been made very clear from some who call themselves Republicans that Unity is far from what they want. I personally hope the SPI can do some good and move people in another direction as the current one is not working and will never work. |
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Post by Stallit 2 de Halfo on Jun 25, 2009 11:25:43 GMT
It seems that former PD (Progressive Democrats) member and president of the 'European Movement International', Pat Cox (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pat_Cox), has stepped down from his post so that he can lead the new 'Ireland for Europe' (www.irelandforeurope.org/) campaign. These right wingers are campaigning for a 'yes' vote obviously and have people like Robbie Keane and other well known figures involved in their campaign. It seems that this campaign will be an uphill battle for the 'No' camp and it could be worth our while getting started sooner rather than later. I think the 'No' camp should be focusing on facts like: 1. If we vote 'yes' we will lose our right to a free transparent referendum on future EU decisions and treaties as the EU can simply over-rule our vote. 2. We have already voted 'No' to this referendum yet they have shown utter contempt for our democratic rights by making us vote yet again. We had to vote twice on the Nice treaty because we rejected it and now we have to vote twice on Lisbon because we rejected it. When will the politicians respect our vote? 3. Politicians have used their powers over us to make us vote twice on 2 seperate referenda. We should use and protect our democratic rights by voting 'No' in this campaign and show politicians that we will not part with our democratic rights! Links: Ireland for Europe wiki - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ireland_for_EuropeEuropean Movement website = www.europeanmovement.euEuropean Movement wiki - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_MovementI did out a leaflet a number of days ago that I was thinking about getting printed up with my main reasons to be against it. I did it on the format of that ICA leaflet - dspace.dial.pipex.com/town/parade/abj76/PG/images/national/lyttleton/join_army.jpg Why change a format that works? ;D Anyway this is it... REASONS WHY
YOU SHOULD VOTE
NO TO LISBON Because It Is:Anti-Democratic: The Irish People have already voted No to this Treaty. It is unacceptable, and entirely undemocratic (let alone patronising), to force referenda until an outcome emerges to which the beuracrats in Brussels and gangster politicians in Ireland are satisfied with. Unless the treaty is changed significantly, then re-running the Lisbon referendum is nothing short of what one would expect under a dictatorship. The results of referenda are the expressed will of the people, to the satisfaction of the people. The outcome SHOULD NOT be to satisfy the agenda of politicians. The Irish people’s decision to vote No should be respected, not spit upon. Illegible: From square one this treaty was written with intention in an incomprehensible way so that YOU wont understand its details and hidden clauses. Numerous politicians have stated they have never even read the treaty, while some politicians in Europe have openly expressed glee in the fact that the treaty is unreadable. Irrespective of how fantastic the contents of the treaty may be, although we believe to the contrary, unless the treaty is re-written in a legible and comprehensible way then it should be rejected. The Lisbon Treaty should be written similar to that of the Irish Constitution, for which the ordinary person can read, understand and interpret for themselves. It should not be left to aloof ‘legal experts’ and spin doctors to interpret this treaty for us. We ourselves should have access and understanding. The treaty should be CLEAR CUT OR NOTHING! Militaristic: This treaty advises all member states to increase military spending and attempts to consolidate the military power of member states. This will fundamentally undermine Irelands neutrality – or what’s left of it. Article 28 states that “all member states shall undertake to progressively improve their military capabilities”. Article 28 also says: “If a member state is the victim of armed aggression on its territory, other member states shall have towards it an obligation of aid and assistance by all means in their power”. The EU was founded as an economic entity. It is clear the elite’s want it to become far more than this. Ireland is under no threat what-so-ever from any form of military aggression, nor have we anything to gain from wasting resources on weapons. And unlike military spending, there is no obligation for an increase in health, education and welfare directed resources. Is this what we want? – an Ireland, or indeed Europe, where military spending is more important than our health and education? Where Europe advises us to increase our military capacity while humans lie slumped in doorways homeless in their tens of thousands? These are just some of the reasons, amongst many, to vote No. The media and mainstream political parties will, and have attempted to, pressurise the Irish people into voting Yes through a campaign of fear. Fear of Ireland being castigated and ostrasiced from europe, and a fear of losing economic assistance. These are a nonsense,.....-------------------- Anyway, yes, I agree with you PapaC. This is going to be an uphill struggle. Its not the 'be all and end all' but it will be a big disappointment if it gets ratified. I think I heard that the treaty is self amending aswell, meaning no further referendums would be held to change its contents. I agree with you aswell about where the focus should lie. |
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Post by Papa C. on Jun 26, 2009 7:09:04 GMT
Very good points there comrade! It would be great to get that printed up and try and round up a posse to leaflet our areas. It wouldn't even cost that much to get printed.
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